Podcasters and real-life friends Jacqui Maguire and Antonia Prebble offer strategies for everyday life issues in their new series What Matters Most.
Jacqui, a clinical psychologist, first encountered Antonia, an actress known for the TV series Outrageous Fortune, in a mother's group.
"[I thought] 'Oh my gosh, she's so famous. Can I talk to her without her thinking that I'm just trying to speak to her because she's Loretta West or can I have a genuine connection with her?" she tells Kathryn Ryan.
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The pair both had their own independent podcasts – Antonia hosting a lifestyle interview show called the most of it and Jacqui a psychology interview series called Mind Brew.
Later, their shared producer thought their shared passion and curiousity about the same things and already friends would make them great podcast co-hosts, Antonia says.
"It's so much nicer doing something with your friend rather than trying to forge a path on your own. It has been a real joy getting to this point.
"Because we do have this genuine relationship with friends, we wanted to create an environment that was warm and candid and more like we're having a conversation … we wanted the people who listen to feel that they are perhaps in the room with us… discussing these issues that affect all of us.
'We hope by listening to this podcast, people understand themselves and the world around them a bit better and are therefore better able to navigate life in perhaps a smoother way."
Jacqui hopes What Matters Most will help people come to see the word 'change' as synonymous with 'growth'.
"Growing and developing and seeking feedback on who you are and how you operate and how you make people feel might be uncomfortable, but in the right setting … the pain and the uncomfortableness is definitely worth it."
As a clinical psychologist, she is trained not to reveal much about her personal life but on the podcast, she and Antonia talk openly about their own experiences.
Antonia, who has two sons aged 1 and 3, says she often feels like making time for friends is a luxury.
"I feel a bit guilty about [spending time with friends] because I feel like I should be prioritising something else."
As we get older, making new friends is made more difficult by the negative bias that often comes with loneliness, Jacqui says.
This can make us so hyper-critical in our search for a perfect friend – "Oh, they're not quite a match. 'Oh no, I don't think I'd form a very good friendship with them" – that we almost prevent ourselves from forming any new relationships.
In fact, it takes seven or eight separate conversations with someone to really form a connection, she says.
Once you decide you enjoy someone's company, find out whether they have the capacity for a new friendship – because, as Jacqui says "not everyone has got the need for new friends."
If they seem to have the capacity, suggest meeting up for a walk or coffee, Jacqui says.
"Once you're there, the real key to friendship is can you bring genuineness to the conversation, AKA can you move your conversation past surface chit-chat.
"If you can follow that process you're on a highway, I think, to more meaningful relationships."
What to do after the "stomach drop" of realising you have to have a difficult conversation with someone is the focus of episode two of What Matters Most.
The best preparation, Jacqui says, is to become really clear on the outcome you want to achieve.
"Are you walking into that conversation just to try and win and be the righteous one that's correct?
Be aware that you're not brandishing "your ammo".
"How many of us do that? I am right, I've got my examples with me and I'm going in guns blazing.
"If you're going in just to prove your point or to get the other person to be on your side or to think the same as you, you're on a highway to nowhere."
Seek to understand as well as be understood, she says.
"If you are aware enough that your viewpoint is just actually a viewpoint and even if you've been hurt or upset or offended that's still your experience."
In the How to Have Difficult Conversations episode, Jacqui and Antonia look at practical strategies for keeping calm when faced with conflict, why you can still have a good relationship with someone you fundamentally disagree with and why a handwritten letter is better than an angry email.
