Michael Forbes pictured during Christopher Luxon's visit to India. Photo: RNZ/Marika Khabazi
The madam of a Wellington brothel has spoken of the moment she was informed the Prime Minister's former deputy chief press secretary had allegedly recorded audio of a session with a sex worker.
She wants something to be done about privacy laws when it comes to recording people without their knowledge.
"This is an issue for all women, women are being recorded, photographed, filmed without their consent or knowledge and heaven only knows where it's ending up. This is the main issue and that's what needs to be focused on."
Stuff reports that Michael Forbes, a former journalist, allegedly recorded audio of multiple sessions with Wellington sex workers, and amassed a gallery of women working out at the gym, shopping, and being filmed through a window getting ready to go out.
Do you know more? Email sam.sherwood@rnz.co.nz
The madam of the Wellington brothel, which RNZ has agreed to not name, said she was at the brothel when a sex worker came out of a room and alleged Forbes was recording audio and showed her his phone.
The madam went into the room while Forbes was in the shower and confronted him.
"I said you were recording, have you done this before and he said 'uhuh'. I said you need to give me your pin number.
"I went through his phone and I instantly found recordings that were named."
She said she told Forbes she needed to keep his phone and he left. She then gave the phone to police.
The madam alleged Forbes had "many recordings on his phone of sex workers".
She knew of some of the women who had been recorded.
"Those who needed to know found out they had been recorded," she says.
The women were shocked, she said.
It had been a "balancing act" for the women involved.
"It's really tricky for sex workers to do things, sometimes because shit can come down on them. In a boys club like the one Michael Forbes is in who knows what the fallout could be. We are decriminalised, it's a legal business, there's a lot of discrimination against us, insurance companies banks and that."
The women who had seen Forbes said he appeared "relatively respectful," the madam said.
Wellington District Manager Criminal Investigations John Van Den Heuvel said in a statement, police received a complaint from a Wellington brothel in July last year, after a client was found to have concerning images and recordings on his phone.
Police investigated and spoke to the individual. The case was filed as the event did not meet the threshold for criminal prosecution.
The madam said she got "slapped more on the wrist than [Forbes]" due to her going through his phone.
"The fact it's not illegal what he did has made it extremely difficult. It looks worse for us than it did for him because it would be our word against his about how we had his phone."
She was glad there had been media publicity.
"I hope it serves as a warning to other people like that that are going around filming, recording, photographing. There's a lot of them, he's the tip of the iceberg."
She said something needed to be done about the privacy laws when it came to recording people without their knowledge.
"This is an issue for all women, women are being recorded, photographed, filmed without their consent or knowledge and heaven only knows where it's ending up. This is the main issue and that's what needs to be focused on."
Forbes has offered an apology for the harm his actions caused to women.
"I want to offer my sincerest apologies to the women I have harmed," he said in a statement.
"In the past, I was in a downward spiral due to unresolved trauma and stress, and when confronted with the impacts of my behaviour a year ago, I sought professional help, which is something I wish I had done much earlier.
"What I failed to do then was make a genuine attempt to apologise. Instead, I tried to move on without offering those I had harmed the acknowledgement, accountability, or amends they deserved. I recognise how wrong that was."
Forbes said he spent the past year "reflecting on how I may have affected these women's sense of safety and ability to go about their lives and work".
"No one should ever feel violated, unsafe, or disrespected, especially in spaces where they should feel secure, and I am truly sorry for contributing to an environment where women may have felt otherwise," he said.
"The therapy I've received over the past year has helped me to understand the roots of my behaviour and begin addressing the patterns that led to it. This is a long-term commitment to change that I take very seriously.
"I understand that my past actions may have undermined the trust people place in me. So, I have resigned from my job to focus on the work I need to do."
RNZ asked Forbes on Wednesday evening if there was anything in the reporting he disputed or disagreed with.
He replied "not really". But believed it was likely some of the photos were consensual ones of his partner.
Asked for comment on Thursday morning about the comments from the madam of the brothel. He declined to comment further.
A spokesperson from the prime minister's office said they were informed at 4pm on 3 June.
"The matters were immediately raised with Ministerial Services and the prime minister was informed that evening. The allegations were serious and concerning. They were discussed with the staff member on the evening of June 3 and it was clear their employment was untenable," the spokesperson said.
"It was agreed that the staff member was stood down that evening and they resigned the following morning. Had the staff member not resigned, we expect their employment would have been terminated after a short investigation.
"As this is an employment matter between the individual and Ministerial Services, the Prime Minister will not be able to comment further."
The Prime Minister is expected to address media at Parliament today .
The office of Forbes' former boss Upston said: "The Minister was not aware of any allegations before they were raised with PMO yesterday. Minister Upston has nothing further to add to the PMs statement on this."
When asked by RNZ why the minister, her office, the prime minister, or the Dignitary Protection Service were not informed of the police investigation into Forbes, Ministerial Services said any questions about the investigation should go to Police.
It also did not answer whether there were any typical thresholds that would see Ministerial Services informed by police of an investigation into an employee.
Deputy secretary partnerships and commissions Hoani Lambert said this was a "serious and concerning matter" for the department.
"We were made aware of this matter late on 3 June and met with the employee that evening. The individual concerned is no longer employed by the Department. We are working with urgency to thoroughly understand what has happened. This includes further engagement with the NZ Police. As the employer, DIA has important obligations to provide a safe workplace and ensure people are held accountable for their behaviour. We are taking this matter seriously, we are moving quickly and ensuring accountability. We will not comment further at this time."
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